Abacus Program Options: Math: Discussion

[TeachingMyToddlers]

I wanted to update this thread, I came across these two a while ago.

http://www.mathgenie.com/home-study/

http://www.abacusbraingym.com/Abacus_Brain_Gym/Store.html


And then parents with Ipads are raving about Adventure Abacus-

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/id568745586



A few other locations updated from another thread:

http://www.playabacususa.com/locations.
http://www.abacusbraingym.com/Abacus_Brain_Gym/Parents_View.html

[A_BC]

Thanks TMT for the insight! I am seriously considering math genie as I liked the videos on their website.

[TeachingMyToddlers]

I updated the original post with some more compiled resources to help teach and inspire. 

[TeachingMyToddlers]

I also wanted to add that my chief issue with ShowMe Soroban and Math Secret is that they are timed. There is such a sense of pass/fail built right in to the program as a result, it makes progress *sloooooooow.* The soroban skills are not isolated, but rather SPEED and SKILL are taught simultaneously which wasn't working too great for my kids. The liked "the birdy game" but did much better with the NON timed portions. For the timed parts, often I would hit the keys and they would say the answer because otherwise slow progress would have turned into NO progress.

Now I find that I much prefer the non-timed apps, it's difficult to teach a child a tricky new skill while they are under pressure to perform it racing against the clock. And apps are clearly much. much more affordable than some of the packaged programs, which is important for our family. It's part of the reason we have not stuck with this subject 100% faithfully yet. I think  the timed programs do have their place and it is a vital component to achieving anzan I am guessing, but we're just not there yet.

Just like when I first started teaching my kids music, I had NO IDEA what I was doing. This is pretty much the same! I wish I was able to have all of these links/resources laid out in the beginning, but I am learning as I go on this one. Quite honestly, I thought we would be much further than we are by this point, but I have not been as dedicated with it as I should have been on account of not having/finding the best resources that fit our family "just right." I was discouraged and set it aside for quite a while. I feel like we are now finally beginning to make progress again, and it is much easier now that the kids have turned 3 & 4.

How is everyone else progressing with learning this, either for you or your child? (probably zipping right along!  )I find the more *I* learn, the much, much better and more comfortable I am at teaching the kiddos.

[TeachingMyToddlers]

I cannot vouch for the quality of any of the following but I found them online recently.

http://www.nsls.in/Products/Nischals-Mathematics-Products/NISCHAL/Abacus/pid-859775.aspx



http://www.freenew.net/iphone/mental-abacus/677214.htm (for ipad, ios 4.2 or later, interactive instruction book)

Uh-oh, this is posting the image very big and I cannot resize. If it breaks the board I'll delete it. 



http://www.alohama.com/main/networks.php (their online beta e-learning demo is working now, just wait for the blue dots to load).

[Mandabplus3]

Do you have these?

[TeachingMyToddlers]

Nope, just found them yesterday. I have been on the hunt for the "perfect" program and these look decent to add to my list of options. I am always a big fan of learning DVDs so I have been looking for abacus videos that appeal to the kids, I just wonder how thick the accent will be on the DVD. It's cheap but I haven't checked on the shipping yet.

Also, I found this website yesterday. The mom documented her children's progress on video after one month, a few months, etc. So inspiring! http://katinaferguson.hubpages.com/hub/The-Soroban

[FomerlyMrsObedih_Now_BatmansMama]

I remember aangeles and her DD making very good progress with Anzan. Just wondering TmT what your ideal path to math would be, I mean would you start with RS Math / Miquon / Mathtacular/ JG  and then transition to Abacus, THEN after the 2/3 years to fully visualise the abacus move on to Saxon math? I wonder 1) because of the cost  would be great to cut out some expense if possible and 2) age of readiness - would the aforementioned programs help get the child ready for the abacus training?

Thanks for the links, it reawakened my interest in the abacus esp reading the broader benefits it gives kids mentally.

[TeachingMyToddlers]

You probably ought to be asking Alex, Ella, Cammie's Moms that question!    We've been a little slower to find our groove in super-duper accelerated math. My kids are far beyond what most kids are learning their age BUT I know what is possible, so we just keep moving forward. They skip count, add and subtract, understand the concepts of multiplication and division although they have not memorized tables. They do patterns, know simple fractions, greater/less/equal to, some measurement and place value. They are not 100% "fluent" on all of those topics but that have a working understanding of them. I wish I would have really begin digging this deeply with soroban resources a long time ago. I just felt so lost with the whole thing and *starting* is the hardest part. Now that I am getting the hang of it, they learning as fast as I teach them.

Having said that, we are using Singapore Math right now as their core. It is very "child friendly" and I would like to get the online supplement www.isingaporemath.com soon to use, as well. We use Destination Math, the lower level online Saxon supplement, on a somewhat less formal basis and they have been watching Peter Weatherall's Math videos periodically for a long time. We mix in Little Math lessons and Youtube skip counting videos as well. For manipulatives, we use the homemade RS abacus and recently started using Cuisinaire rods to mix things up, which my kids love, as well. 

I have plans to move over to Saxon when the time is right, but Singapore is preferable for my kids at the moment. I can tell just by looking at the Saxon samples online, they are so bare bones my daughter would probably run away screaming. For us what has worked or (is working right now anyway)

Early Exposure: LM, Peter Weatherall Math DVDs, modified JG quantity cards, lots of food/toy math, TW Math DVD, YCCD, Leapfrog Math DVD's, geometric 3D shapes, Singapore Early Bird

Later we did/are doing: Destination Math, Singapore, Singapore online supplement soon, place value cards, RS abacus, soroban (*we still incorporate several of the things above)

Eventually: Transition to Saxon and who knows what else?

If I had to do it again, I would have focused more on math and introduced the things are are doing now sooner. I laid down some basics in math and then focused on music for a while, now we are circling back to math again. Math and piano are now the first things we tackle in the morning. BUT that is only because the kids are doing well in reading, that was always my first priority above anything else.

Now I want to hear from the other moms who can share their secrets with us on the ideal math sequence





-

[Korrale4kq]

That Singapore math program looks interesting. I wonder if there are Singapore specific  math apps..... There seem to be apps for everything.

For math James is working mostly with apps. He has to do at least a little math everyday. He uses 5 different apps currently. Eurotalk 3-5 math, Math Skill Builders, Montessori Numbers, Teach Me 1st grade and Bugsy Kindergarten Math. My kid loves Bugsy the most because he loves to shop.

I incorporate math informally daily. I am able to use the progress reports on his apps to figure out what he needs work with.  I also do 1 teaching session that is 15-30 minutes long 5 days a week. What this session covers is struggling concepts and new ideas. I dont go over and rehash stuff that he knows well. I use worksheets from Singapore math, spectrum math and a variety of workbooks. I also use lessons from Right Start, Miquon, montessori stye, touch math/JG dot matrix. I throw in my own things a lot.
James also watches Mathtacular daily. He loves it.

I know this seems like a lot but it really isn't. Informal math happens ALL the time via work and play. James learnt fractions from me cutting his sandwhich every day. He also learnt ordinal numbers  by me giving him a selection of books and asking which one I was going to read 1st, 2nd and 3rd. James learnt left and right while sitting in the car. We would tell him to look out the left or right windows to see things as we drove by. He learnt middle while snuggling in bed with us. Fun times.

My trick is to use a whiteboard up on the wall to write down things James needs to work on. I then informally use these concepts for everything.

I know I want to start introducing a real soroban. I have to buy one first. I absolutely love Abacus Adventure. I have enjoyed playing it and I am at an upper level. James likes it, but it is slow going. I think having a real abacus will be more fun for him.
I don't know when and how I plan to implement soroban yet. I am not sure if I will teach it as part of his math. Or if I will teach it separately. I teach phonics and reading separately.

I MAY seperate math lessons into 2 sessions.... Strictly computation in one lesson. Then concepts in a second.
In computation I may teach all the ways to do arithmetic side by side. This would cover number lines, number bonds,  base ten, counting manipulatives, touch math/dot matrix and abacus.... or maybe this might be too confusing.

[lzp11]

Thanks for updating all this info TMT - Karma to you - the first post in this thread is really useful.

We are making steady progress with soroban.  In the family, I have probably made the most progress myself using various apps, such as Adventure abacus, Master Soroban and Fingermath.  Although I am by no means brilliant, it has really helped to develop my understanding of the approach to addition and subtraction.  I have not yet learned anything about multiplication though.  But this has at least improved my confidence to teach it using the apps.

My DD (now 3y 9m) is making steady progress with adventure abacus.  It is slow but I am happy as she continues to be willing to engage with the app which is very positive.  I like the fact that you can just do one level which takes less than five minutes.  We try to do one or two levels maybe 3-4 days a week.  She has developed a lot of confidence with manipulating the app 'beads' in the 1-9 column.  She is easily able to count to 9.  We used the Rightstart yellow is the sun song to help with understanding the 5 bead and this has worked really well (it has actually also helped as I'm now starting to teach about money and different coin values - the concept is very similar).  She is now very happy with adding and subtracting up to 9 but we have not yet started any form of re-grouping.  I'm also starting counting up to 100.  So far we have got to 20 and then do 2-ten, 3-ten, 4-ten etc.  I must say that the rightstart approach to counting also helps make sense of the columns of the soroban.

Adventure abacus includes mental arithmetic levels for progress.  I try to do this myself but with my DD I have been getting her to do the calculations on a simplified abacus (5 columns) that I bought and then enter the answer.  It's a little more fiddly than the app so we are just getting to grips with it.  But it's a good transition activity and she has to know and enter the answer so it helps me check that she really does understand what she's doing!

I've been using a song to teach number bonds to 10 based on the tune of row row row your boat:
9 and 1 are number bonds
8 and 2 are friends
7 and 3, 6 and 4
5 and 5 are twins

I made a short powerpoint presentation to go with it - I'll upload this here at the weekend.  This seems to be working!  My DD sang it through a couple of times herself!  But I'm not sure how it will be when it comes to using it to re-group for the soroban! 

I'd be interested to know if most people teach the 5 number bonds re-grouping before 10 as in adventure abacus they start with the 10 (e.g. 4 plus 8 would be add 10 and take away 2), rather than the five (e.g. 3 plus 4 would be add 5 and take away 1).  Or perhaps it doesn't matter?  Any thoughts much appreciated.

At the moment, I'm happy with apps and my own limited knowledge to teach.  I hope this will be sufficient for a while, but it sure is cost effective! 

Having looked at Singapore math it seems to be a good fit with Rightstart and Soroban so it is my plan to continue RS level A and move onto Singapore.  I don't think saxon would be a great fit for us, too much drill, although keeping a very open mind following the kids personality and interests over the next few years.

I must admit I was very excited to see that online Singapore site - this may be perfect for us!  Workbooks are not particularly popular in our house, but the computer is a much bigger hit.  There are some Singapore apps I think, but i haven't found any for the younger years yet. 

[PokerDad]

In computation I may teach all the ways to do arithmetic side by side. This would cover number lines, number bonds,  base ten, counting manipulatives, touch math/dot matrix and abacus.... or maybe this might be too confusing.

I'm sure this is what you meant, but why not just demonstrate a problem (such as 8 + 2 = 10) in various ways in seriatim? It's the same problem, they'd know the answer, but could see it in different perspectives

[FomerlyMrsObedih_Now_BatmansMama]

I searched the word Soroban on the forum and have been getting a deep education from Tom (user Soroban), Chris1, Pokerdad (amazing book review) and others. Any parent relatively new to the topic NEED to do this!

I have found a few soroban schools within driving distance in the UK (franchises though), this one in particular looks interesting http://www.ucmasuk.info/Contact/centres.aspx they accept student from 4years old, the other previously mentioned here was Aloha but I wasn't too impressed by the one example they showed. Any feedback from those more experienced on the curriculum used by ucmas uk would be much appreciated!

[Korrale4kq]

In computation I may teach all the ways to do arithmetic side by side. This would cover number lines, number bonds,  base ten, counting manipulatives, touch math/dot matrix and abacus.... or maybe this might be too confusing.

I'm sure this is what you meant, but why not just demonstrate a problem (such as 8 + 2 = 10) in various ways in seriatim? It's the same problem, they'd know the answer, but could see it in different perspectives

I THINK we are thinking the same thing PokerDad. I just want to make sure James know that there are different ways to get the right answer. And I want him to see how it works. I tutor a 5th grader and I have been showing her some mental short cuts, or easier ways to do problems. And it is mind boggling how little she really understands. She is bright and can learn an algorithm once it is taught, but she can't fathom that 6x41 is the same as 41+41+41+41+41+41. And she can't do the problem mentally because she can't understand that 6x41 is 240+6.

I just want my son to be able to see how numbers go together.

[Mela Bala]

I have spent quite some time reading all of the discussions about teaching our children with the abacus and soon hope to be participating with experiences.  I am hoping Soroban has some time to let us know about the progress of the program he was working on.  In the meantime I was hoping if I could get a yes or no on this Japanese abacus I found online through amazon.  I do not want to purchase something that will end up confusing my son once we start learning with a program.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005VMDRHA/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_5?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A1THAZDOWP300U

Thanks in advance 

I am also thinking about purchasing this DVD rom to learn about the abacus.  I like the description but again do not want to have to start something that will have to be unlearned.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00561ZV7A/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_7?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

Edit- decided to go with something different

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