Perfect Pitch Training?

[Violin]

Hello Everyone!

I am curious to know if any of you have done perfect pitch training with your children? If so, have any of you tried any other methods besides the Doman-style ones that I have read about on this forum?

I found a website: www.wehearandplay.com which seems to promote an interesting game-approach to perfect pitch training and learning the basics for piano-playing between for children ages 3-5. The "Taneda Method" apparently was developed in Germany. The "We Hear and Play" 3 volume course is translated into English from the original German version written by Mr. and Mrs. Taneda.

I am interested in hearing about any of your experiences.

Thanks in advance,
Violin

[cybermommy]

I haven't done any perfect pitch training with my child, although I find the concept interesting. I happen to have perfect pitch myself, and I found reading the website interesting, although sometimes a bit over the top, for example, "The coming generation will discover a meaning and delight in sound which has, until now, been inaccessible to humankind." (Suggesting that those of us who do have perfect pitch have meaning and delight but are somehow inhuman?)

From what I could find by a superficial examination of the links, I did not see any examples of specific games to see if I thought this would be indeed something my 3 year old would engage in, so I'm not sure what I think of their program.

I personally find perfect pitch to be helpful, although it's not the Holy Grail of music education the proponents of this system seem to promote. I memorize and learn pieces proficiently, but so did my sister, who didn't have perfect pitch. I didn't have more confidence before performances--I usually threw up before auditions. I do find it easy to sing parts because I can ignore the tendency to follow the melody. Singing with different pianos all tuned differently throws me off for a little while until I force myself to retune. Singing in another key altogether makes me crazy.

One thing that struck me about this particular program is that they suggest that a 3-5 year old can't read musical notation, especially without colored notes. I learned at the age of 4 from my mother without colors or any $300 program. This program's timeline shows children introduced to traditional black and white notation at age 6 or 7. Maybe it's so they can sell more plastic balls and stickers, deliberately produced in colors that would be hard to find elsewhere. $30 for 7 plastic balls is crazy, and they want you to buy 4 sets of them?

My feeling is, perfect pitch is a handy thing to have, sort of like being able to whistle through your fingers to hail a taxi, or being able to tell if it's going to rain by the feel in your bones. I don't think it ensures that one is going to have a successful career in music, or so dramatically enhance one's perception of the auditory world that he or she is on some stratosphere "inaccessible to humans." It does mean that the out of tune jingle to NPR will grate one one's nerves especially early in the morning.

[rose08]

Just curious but how do u know if u have perfect pitch? I can hear a note played and then sing that same note perfectly. have never had any training so not sure if that is what is meant by perfect pitch.

[KL]

Singing with different pianos all tuned differently throws me off for a little while until I force myself to retune. Singing in another key altogether makes me crazy.

That's very interesting, Cybermommy!  I don't have perfect pitch, but it bugs me when singing in a group and the pitch slowly slides flat.  But why would singing in another key drive you crazy?

Also, do you think your perfect pitch ability was something you were born with, or was there anything you or your parents did when you were young to cultivate it?

[KL]

Just curious but how do u know if u have perfect pitch? I can hear a note played and then sing that same note perfectly. have never had any training so not sure if that is what is meant by perfect pitch.

Perfect pitch means someone who can hear a note and know exactly what note it is.

If you drop a fork, for example, it makes a sound with a frequency (at least a dominant frequency), and many with perfect pitch can tell you what note that is (or the closest note).  This music teacher I had in school was incredible - he could tell the exact frequency of a sound - we would test him with a keyboard where we can turn the knob to raise or lower teh frequency, and he would get it almost exactly right. I'm not talking about notes, I'm talking about frequency, like 476 Hz ! (or something)

[rose08]

Thanks for that. It is amazing some of the abilities that people have. I wish that my parents had given me more chances to learn as a child as trying to learn now as an adult is a lot harder.

Will definitely be teaching my child perfect pitch so that if she wants to have a career in music she will have a head start.

[Cristofori]

KL, that's pretty wild!

My daughter has perfect pitch.  No one else in our extended family has it.  The only thing we did to foster it was playing the Trebellina DVD for her as a baby.  She can now tell you what any note is if she only hears it.  This includes sharps and flats.  In addition, if you strike a key without her seeing it, she can run over and play the same key.  She can sometimes sing a note that you tell her to, but she is not as good at that yet.  Still practicing!

[cybermommy]

KL,

It sounds like you have a very good sense of relative pitch if the group sliding flat drives you nuts. I can totally relate to that.

I should have clarified about singing in another key. I hate singing in church in a different key from what is printed in the hymnal or the bulletin if I don't know the song. Then I have to sight read AND transpose, and it's just another step that takes my mind off the words of the song, and I have no idea what I'm even singing until I've got the melody down, which is by verse 3 or 4. Also, if I know that the hymnal has the song printed in a certain key, and the pianist is transposing it up a step or two, and everyone is shrieking to reach the high notes, then I think she would have been better off leaving it in the original key.

I may have been born with perfect pitch. My sister and I both started piano young (around age 4), but I have it and she doesn't. My parents probably don't even know I have it. I'm sure they didn't train it. My piano teacher decided to test all her students when I was in grade school, and she found out I had it. She was the one who told me what it was, but didn't make a huge deal out of it.

As for singing a tone on command, I think that is really hard, because tones are in a continuum, like a spectrum. So nailing the exact frequency is really tough. If someone told you to go to the store and buy the olive shirt that matched her skirt, and told you the brand and design collection, it would be easy. But if you had to find the shirt without that information, and there were all sorts of shirts that could be called olive, it would be hard to find that exact shade just from memory. Or even harder, mix up your own olive using a color palette.

[purplefungi]

That's crazy, KL, about the frequency!

[nhockaday]

So how would you know if your child has it?

[cybermommy]

I would imagine that the child would have to be old enough to learn the names of the notes and to communicate them back to the tester. There are hearing tests for preverbal babies, but they just rely on demonstrating that the brain is stimulated when a sound is played.

[cybermommy]

I suppose another way you would know would be if your child consistently sang a particular song in the same key that he or she heard it played, when it had been hours or days since she had heard it. For instance, if she is singing the theme of her favorite TV show in the right key when she hasn't watched in a few days, that would be a pretty good sign, I would think.

[staceycanada]

Hmmm I haven't tried this program or any other. I hadn't really thought about pitch training but what a neat idea.

[KL]

She can now tell you what any note is if she only hears it.  This includes sharps and flats.  In addition, if you strike a key without her seeing it, she can run over and play the same key. 

That's so cool!

I should have clarified about singing in another key. I hate singing in church in a different key from what is printed in the hymnal or the bulletin if I don't know the song. Then I have to sight read AND transpose, and it's just another step that takes my mind off the words of the song, and I have no idea what I'm even singing until I've got the melody down, which is by verse 3 or 4.

Ah, I get it - yes, I can imagine that would be very confusing! Still, give me perfect pitch any day and I'll happily live with this 'problem'! 

As for singing a tone on command, I think that is really hard, because tones are in a continuum, like a spectrum. So nailing the exact frequency is really tough. If someone told you to go to the store and buy the olive shirt that matched her skirt, and told you the brand and design collection, it would be easy. But if you had to find the shirt without that information, and there were all sorts of shirts that could be called olive, it would be hard to find that exact shade just from memory. Or even harder, mix up your own olive using a color palette.

Yes. Still have a look at these kids doing this:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/AWyFQK4tNMo&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/AWyFQK4tNMo&rel=1</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/kim2ZVa4X3Y&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/kim2ZVa4X3Y&rel=1</a>

No singing here, but excellent note recognition!

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/QSjr69wCkDs&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/QSjr69wCkDs&rel=1</a>

Amazing, huh?!

[Ouroboros1]

I've been investigating developing my baby's musical abilities while he's still young and mostly right brained.  I've come across Tweedlewink which has a musical component, Trebellina DVD, and the Little Musician that is coming soon.

I've read about using tuning forks to train babies to hear notes/tones.  Has anyone used tuning forks with success?  They're kind of expensive, but I'm willing to get them and use them if they are effective.

I've read Suzuki's books, although since my baby is 5.25 months old, dexterity to play seems an issue.  (He does love plunking away while sitting at the piano in his Bumbo though!)  I was interested in starting something sooner to train his ears.  All I think I got from Suzuki books was to play a piece of music every day, so that he will recognize it as "his music". 

My plan is to go through David L Burge's absolute pitch program for myself, and have baby nearby.  My thought is he'll probably pick it up much faster than daddy, but hopefully we'll both be better for the experience.  It's pretty exhaustive, going through intervals and then chord recognition, finding tonics, etc. 

I'm interested if anyone else has anything they've found that works.

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