my next blog learning to swim

[Kimba15]

http://intellikidsdownunder.blogspot.com/2012/01/learning-to-swim.html ENJOY feel free to ask questions or leave comments.

[PokerDad]

Looks like a wonderful lesson. Keep up the great work!

I'm going to nibble on this bait a bit here, because this topic hits me square in the face. My apologies in advance if I'm out of line...

I was a really successful swimmer. As in, REALLY. I didn't win an Olympic Gold or anything, but I competed against several that did. My former coach married one of the all-time Olympic champs from Australia, and this champ was even helpful to me when I was in college (would get in and show me a few things) - so I know quite well how the Australian culture emphasizes swimming. I think that's a great thing.

At around 1995, I worked at a water park during the morning shift. Well, perhaps this morning shift is how I got to Brillkids in a round about way. You see, there was this father that brought in his little boy that couldn't walk yet. The newbie's name was Jessie, and Jessie changed the way I viewed babies. This father would come in and practice with his son. You could imagine my astonishment, fear, whatever you want to call it, when the father took a baby that could not walk and threw him into the water unassisted.

Little Jessie popped up, rolled over, spit out a stream of water as though he was playing around with it, and then smiled. He then winged and kicked his way over to his father. From this moment forward, I would never view infants as helpless bodies that couldn't learn or do remarkable things and that we in our western culture routinely sell our infants short.

When I hear about infant swimming, I don't visualize the swim lessons that we used to teach at the pool ("mommy and me" sessions) - what a waste of money IMO. No, when I think of infant swimming, I think of Jessie.

When I first learned that we were pregnant 17 weeks ago, I immediately began researching infant swimming. If you google "infant aquatics" you'll see some videos that look just like little Jessie.
I bought about 8 infant swimming books. Only 1 of them was what I was looking for: "Watersafe Your Baby in One Week"

After reading up on this topic, I can chime in with a little bit of what I've found. You want to start those swim lessons before 6 months if possible, but certainly before age 1. The key is the fear factor that starts to settle in after age 1.

It sounds like you're conquering this quite nicely. I think this is the  - to teach that swimming is fun and not something to be feared.

This past summer, I was hanging out with my uncle in his swimming pool with his 4 kids. The youngest, aged 3.5, was swimming in the adjacent hot tub (heat not turned on) where he could stand up on the bench seating. Well at one point, I was about 5 feet away and I see my aunt gasp from the other side of the yard, she's freaking out that her son in the hot tub is struggling. I quickly jump over the barrier to reach the little boy as he feebly attempts to reach for the wall. Unfortunately, my body was still half way in the hot tub and half way out and I couldn't get to him by about three inches.

It all worked out okay, but that kid was traumatized and crying like crazy when we finally got to him.

EVERY SINGLE adult I have ever seen that cannot or will not swim as a full grown adult (the type that take adult swim lessons), had suffered some scare like that at some point in their life (usually as a kid).

Training a kid not to be afraid can actually backfire if one of these unfortunate scares happen; if they do, make twice as sure to get them back in the water to face their fear or the revulsion might create a life long phobia.

It is for this reason that I'm biting on this post a bit and chiming in with my own experiences and observations. Swimming lessons are great. Actually learning HOW TO SWIM is even better!

Now, as for championship caliber swimming... this probably will go for almost any sport out there, but the guys I knew in college that were going to NCAAs were NOT the swimmers that were crushing the state championships at 7 years old (only 1 swimmer I know did this). My Best Man quit the sport at age 22 ranked 10th in the world and he didn't start training until he was 12! (I think that's about as late as I've ever seen though). I mention this just to say that starting early does not equate to Olympic champs. It's two different things really. I think this observation might also have some insight to the question of what happens to Doman educated kids when they're older. That's a whole separate topic, but perhaps germane to the observation.

[Kimba15]

Kieren Perkins did not start swimming until late in life and that was because he shattered his leg in some accident and part of his recovery was swimming.  He went on to hold the World Record for the 1500m in the pool and I also thnk the 800m to? He was later smashed by another Australian.

I just wanted to clear up that children in Australia are in the pool early mainly because parents want to protect them in the water. The beach and people with pools are everywhere here in Australia and no parent wants there child to drown. Most Australians wouldn't really know about the early lrearning benefits of swimming and sadly most probably aren't interested either.

On a another note as you stated that early swimming does not produce everyone to become an olympic champian and that is true but does it make you wonder why Australia does produce so many good Olympic Champians is it because of the early push into the pool? who knows. If my dd's want to jon a squad when they are older that is fine or get invted to jon I will support them but  wont be pushing them into it. I don't fancy getting up at 4am to take them swimming.

I wonder if that is why we don't here of about DOman kids when they grow up because of the non-push approach and let the child show you? Maybe so many of these children may have gone into fields that don't equate with 'smart' status such as Dr. Lawyer, Scientist. Maybe many have gone into fields that they enjoy or education themselves and now manyh of the are teachers or early childhood specialists? Landscapers or horticulturlists or even trades. (Even though you have to be smart to be in a trade?

Thoughts?

[PokerDad]

I'm heading out for the weekend, but before I go thought I'd stop in really quick.

I don't want to derail the great blog post, but I do think it's nice to discuss how things fit together.

Kieren Perkins started swim team when he was 8 years old. This sounds about right to me, I started when I was 9 years old. I know of a handful of swimmers that started earlier than 8 and very few of them were around at the upper echelon as older teens or adults. I would NOT consider taking up a concentrated focus at age 8 as being older. My buddy started at 12 and that's about as old as I've ever heard of.

I also don't know how much my observation would translate to other things, but I'm positive there's a lesson to be learned in there somewhere.

If you think about it, there's a large gap between the ability of the 8 year old state champ, and the 18 year old state champ. One is probably competing at nationals against the very best and the other is competing against other 8 year olds.
Well, there's as much, if not more of, a wide gap between the 4 year old that can crank out some simple addition and a noble prize physicist. That 4 year old has a huge jump start on their peers should they want to become a noble prize physicist, but there are so many more skills and knowledge that need to be obtained before such breakthrough type mental convergence can happen (the type of convergence that results in a new discovery or theory worthy of winning a prize), just like the 8 year old champ will have to develop physically as well as mentally and skill wise to ever achieve the 18 year old champ status.

In swimming, the function of training is so important. Nearly every parent alive could teach their kid how to swim across a pool. Very few of them could take an Ian Thorpe and turn him into a world record holder; someone else has to do that.

I think this same "training" function exists in pretty much most areas of study or excellence.

Most parents have enough intelligence to do a Doman program with their child and get that child off to great start, but how many parents could take that same kid all the way through to the top of the heap? Very few.
This is one reason why that adage "Einstein never used flash cards" is BS. Einstein was not self taught and had a savant type obsession with physics that finally won the day. Further, we aren't necessarily trying to create Einsteins when we do Doman programs, just like we're not trying to create future Olympic champs with infant swimming lessons.

Which brings in the other factors like you mentioned. Emotions play a big part. Most of the swimmers I knew that were crushing it when they were 10 years old probably could have gone on to at least compete in college (but they'd have to adapt their skill upwards) simply because it's obvious they have some talent, BUT so many of them just flat out quit (and another percentage don't improve their skill; something necessary as speeds increase)
Even I quit at one point... actually at two points.
Others get injured (usually due to crummy training:; my wife was never elite (at any age) at swimming and didn't put in the serious amount of time that the hardcore swimmers do, but she cannot mix cookie dough to this day because she had a lousy coach that didn't know what he was doing, and her shoulder is messed up for life.

Sometimes, even the guy crushing it at 18 years old does not go on to do anything significant... one guy I know was the fastest in the nation at 18 years old, set destroyed the national high school record, was fast enough to make a top NCAA finish... somehow by the time he was 19, he had regressed to barely above average college swimmer. I'm not really sure how this guy's colossal slide happened, but he did switch training teams in college which may have contributed some. Fortunately, I can't really think of any other stories this dramatic; most of the time, where someone is at this age is a very good predictor for where they'll be 4 years later.

Anyhow, great discussion. I'm heading out for the weekend... catch up later!

[Ayesha Nicole]

Hi! 

Kimba > great blog post!  I want the girls to take swimming lessons in the summer and they will be 5+.  I learned to swim when I was 7 or 8, and was on a swim team for a few years, but I think I was the slowest swimmer.   

PokerDad > Did you read the Doman book on swimming?  I would like your opinion on it, please.

http://www.gentlerevolution.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=G&Category_Code=PhysDevSwim

Thanks.

Ayesha

[lois1]

Hi Kimba, I'll be following your blog with interest. I live in a tropical climate, perfect for outdoor water activities year round. I noticed your little girl is using a little flotation ring in 1 of the pictures, what's it called? Are arm bands a thing of the past?

Poker Dad - you mentioned the 1 year cut off & you're right. My son is 14 months old, for various reasons we didn't get to the pool for a couple of months, previously he had loved it, although I think I was guilty of the mummy &me thing  I had never heard of teaching a baby to "really" swim till I read your post. (I'm a new convert to early education.) This last visit however, my normally placid little guy screamed blue murder... I cold turkeyed him into his safety seat thing & he settled down quite quickly but it wasn't pleasant. Fortunately we had the pool to ourselves:-)

So what would you suggest I do, is it too late? (I'm going to google it just now too) but any input greatfully received. How frequently should I be taking him (well, minimum, obviously the more frequently the better).

Thanks,
Lois

[lois1]

Am in the process of answering my own question & realise that I'm not too late:-)

Came across a few websites that may be useful:

Based in the US
http://www.infantaquatics.com/index.htm
http://www.infantswim.com/

And in the UK
http://www.swimwithyourkids.co.uk/store/pages/home.html
The DVD is downloadable & gets a good review from a parent who was a lifeguard & swimming instructor. There is also a book.

[iwini]

I am  slow swimmer,but very much interested to teach swimming to my Lil,But i was in confusion should i introduce her swimming classes.His father is a fast swimmer,but she is underweight?  Will it hamper her development.
I am thankful to  the bloggers. Interesting links and sharing.
poker Dad, your sharing s and experiences are really enchanting.

[Mandabplus3]

Hmm I read this with interest. I think swimming classes for little kids in Australia have a lot to answer for. I personally know of 8 kids who have done these classes from 6 months and at 3 still can't swim enough to get themselves out of a pool if they fall in! Save your money, do a tiny bit of research and teach them your self. Bt only take this advice if you will actually do it, any lesson is better than none ( perhaps?) I taught my three kids to swim when they were between two and three. Depending on the age they were over summer. They all loved the water and it took me only two weeks ( in the pool twice a day) to teach them to fall in turn around get to the edge and get out. The most valuable lesson! Over 6 months I taught them bouancy and dog paddle skills. Then diving, duck diving and " big arms" and breathing. We don't have a pool but I always get in with my kids when we have access to a pool.  My boy was swimming at 2 ( jump in swim across climb out) but had a scare at the end of last summer ( the worst possible timing) now he doesnt trust me in the water ( I was the closest adult when he couldn't get himself out of an unfamiliar pool) so I pay a private teacher to give him a lesson in the neighbors pool, just to build his confidence again. While she is there she does some stroke correction work with the girls, as that is beyond me. Well actually I don't want to learn everything to teach my kids! Any way I just wanted to let you know it's not hard to get your kids swimming and water safe, my girls are great swimmers for their age. It really wasn't a lot of work, in fact it was quite fun!

[Tanikit]

Here in South Africa children do learn to swim young and there are also a lot of drownings - I find most drownings occur when there are too many adults around - everyone presumes someone else is watching the children. I have a rule that there is only ever one adult per child watching and they are assigned to a specific child (when my kids swim I have to be one adult for two children but then I am the only one there) As for swimming lessons I do not believe that they will make a child water safe - children and children and same as they cannot be trusted to cross the road correctly til much older they need to be watched around water - that is our resposnibility. Yes it can help to get them used to water and could possibly save them if they were to fall in when you weren't around, but the panic involved is too much and much of what is learnt would not be automatic and would be forgotten. And adult who can swim must always be around and pools should be netted or fenced or kept closed when not in use. Just like dogs who are mostly natural swimmers can and do drown, so too can children and even much older children as emotionally they are not ready for that kind of resposnsibility and same as they may not drive for similar reasons (ability to predict consequences) they should be observed when swimming.

My children are learning to swim because they enjoy it and because we have a pool and it is a good skill to have. We do teach safety around the pool and in the pool but I would never expect them to actually be safe by themselves til much much older.

[PokerDad]

I think there's some great advice. Lessons or not, little ones ought not be left alone or unsupervised in a pool. In college, they'd freak out if I got in by myself  I would have to convince the coach to let me get in unsupervised. In my final year, I'd even swim with all the lights in the building turned off (sensory deprivation) - but if the wrong person saw me do this, someone could get in trouble for it. How much more should a little one that can barely make it across the pool (if that) be trusted unsupervised?

@ Ayesha Nicole, I have NOT read Doman's book on swimming. My library doesn't have it and I would have to buy it... I already bought so many swimming books and children's books that my wife has now banned me from Amazon for a while  . It looks as though he's on my same train of thought that introducing a swimming pool is not learning how to swim anymore than introducing the alphabet is learning how to read. Yeah, you need that introduction but we're talking about two different things.

I'd also like to point out that I have no experience taking an infant to any level of skill. I facilitated a mommy and me session once when I was a teenager, but again, two different things. What I have done is read some books that I bought, and the one I mentioned goes through a progression that makes sense to me. I'm not sure I totally feel comfortable doing it myself though - so right now I'm leaning towards hiring the local infantaquatics.com instructor (not exactly cheap), and then training our second child when the time comes (I plan on recording the swim lessons so that I can see the progression in action).

Once my child can actually put its face into the water and attempt to go somewhere, I have zero doubt that I can build that skill set up to the very top (should my child actually want to pursue competitive swimming) - it's that initial part that I don't yet understand.

And learning after age 1 is NOT too late, it's just that learning before that is easier. Kids learn to read at age 7 or 8 and go on to be okay; but we all know there's an easier way  The same is true with many things. I don't remember learning how to swim. I doubt I had any lessons at all until I signed up for beginner 1 when I was around 3rd grade - I was over skilled for the class and they just kept graduating me up and up. A few months later I joined a team thinking it was the greatest thing since sliced bread. I just had a knack for it I guess.

Perhaps a good "do it yourself" would be to wait until the child has developed enough physically that swimming is just not that much to ask, and then take it from there. Infant swimming (where they can't even walk or talk yet) seems to me like you need to have a good plan and idea of what you're doing, why you're doing it, and what you'll do next.
Swimming with someone that can walk and talk is perhaps a bit easier.

@iwini, I doubt being underweight at this point would really be a big deal. I've seen some very little kids with a lot of skill before. The less weight to move, the easier it is! It's much more difficult chugging a 180lb (82 kg) body through the water. At two years old, I think there's enough development physically that learning how to swim across the pool should be achievable even if underweight. All it will take is 1. confidence enough and 2. being able to submerge the face. If you have those two ingredients, a child can swim (even if it's sort of "ugly" swim at first). The reason is because once the face goes into the water, the rest of the body can balance out on TOP of the surface of water and locomotion is easy.. some simple kicking or basic arm stroke motion will propel a child through the water.

The problem is teaching fearful kids how to swim. If they can't put their face in the water, or are reluctant to do it, the child needs A LOT more strength to paddle with the head up. The gravity acting on the above surface head and face pushes everything else downwards, and usually the feet will drag down so that the child is at a 45 degree angle. Kids that have their face above water will almost never have the strength or skill to also stroke above the water, hence the need for dog paddling.

Great discussion!

[mybabyian]

So true about not leaving a child unsupervised.  I was a competitive swim coach to kids who were good swimmers.  One of the biggest dangers around a pool are spinal cord injuries.  Kids have no fear and just jump in wherever - however.  One of our best swimmers who was in high school suffered a spinal cord injury at practice and doctors predicted he may never walk again.  He fully recovered.  I am sure the fact that he was in excellent shape helped his recovery. 

I also taught Mommy and Me.  Really it was a joke.  I had no idea what I was doing and they gave me no training.  Maybe they thought that because I was a swim coach I would know what to do.  Teaching babies is very different than teaching swimming as a sport.  Now, my son (15 months) and I go to Mommy and Me and it is actually very good.  They do things like in the Doman book.  So, I think it depends where you go. 

The problem with Mommy and Me is that usually you go once a week and that's really not enough.  Doman's book recommends 5 times a week which is really the essence of his philosophy - repeat often, have fun, stop before the kid wants to stop, etc. 

My baby can swim.  That is if I put him about 12 inches from the stairs he can swim to them and climb up.    He does actually swim a lot better than the other kids though.  I think the reason is that first, we go 3 times a week and second, when the instructor is not working with us I have him practice swimming underwater.  So he gets A LOT more repetition.  The important thing is that he has fun with it.  I really couldn't keep him above water if I tried.  He says "more" and "bubble."  It is really cute.  It is so much fun for me to be his mommy!

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