My 22 m old can swim Freestyle but can't read

[mybabyian]

I once read an article about milestones.  It happened to be about when children learn to jump.  My son had been trying so I thought I would find out.  Everyone who left comments said how early their little ones learned to jump.  This infuriated one angry dad who said it wasn’t scientifically possible that everyone’s baby learned to jump so far ahead of the curve.  Obviously, I thought, this is not a scientific sample of moms – that is, it is not representative of the population.  If your toddler jumps when most other toddlers do or a bit late you probably wouldn’t bother to leave a comment about it.

So I always wonder, since there are no Early Learning reading milestone charts to follow, what would be the average age that kids learn to read if they follow an Early Learning program?  Everyone who posts here has really impressive stories.  But are they unusual?  Maybe other moms aren’t posting because they are still waiting to see results?

I was never a skeptic and I still am not.  It just makes sense to me that babies can learn way more than they are given credit for when I look at how they master language better than any adult.  My son however, cannot read.  I started him as a small infant with flash cards.  He didn’t like them so we stopped for awhile.  At about a year old I got Little Reader.  He liked it but has not seemed to learn anything from it – as far as recognizing words go.  He has recognized some words not from Little Reader, but very few.  And often a word that he once recognized he won’t recognize it the next time.  I don’t think he is hiding his knowledge as he happily volunteers other things he knows, like colors, shapes, etc.

I am not really concerned about it as he seems so far advanced when I see other kids his age.  He speaks in long sentences in both English and Spanish.  He understands grammar to the point where he generalizes grammar to irregular words.  He knows multiple words to describe the same thing, for example he knows little, small, tiny, etc.

He understands math concepts.  He has been heard counting up to the teens in both languages and back down again, although he won’t do it when asked.  And, one day he had two drinks and wanted another one.  I told him no because he already had two.  He cried, “Three!!!!”  I thought okay he knows how to add!

He seems pretty physically advanced too.  Yesterday he swam full fledged freestyle strokes.  He had been sort of doing it before but one arm really wouldn’t come out of the water.  Yesterday I was so amazed he did 5 strokes with both arms fully coming out of the water.  He has even done butterfly although his arms don’t really come out much when he does it.  I never thought he would be able to do this before he turned 2!

It is so amazing to me all the things he can do.  I always think so why can’t he read?  I remember reading another mom’s thread who was having a similar issue who joked that she couldn’t go to the pediatrician and ask why her toddler wasn’t reading yet.      I thought that was hilarious because I would ask that too, but I know the doctor would think I was a complete lunatic!

I know he will learn to read eventually.  And I happen to think that as long as I am reading to him and developing his language skills that this is going to be way more important in the long run.  Anyway, just wondering if anyone else has experienced anything similar.

[Mandabplus3]

Arms out of the water freestyle at age 2 is pretty impressive! Wow! You know how hard thet is to do when your head is SO big relative to your body? Great stuff!
I would say from reading between the lines that your boy is still almost completely right brained. His ability to count up and back while playing but not on call suggests he has the information in there but isn't yet able to draw on it with ease. Keep showing him the words, he will get it. At some point the connection will be solid enough for him to grap that info and speak it too.
When i was flashing words to my girls they didn't always tell me what a word was when I showed them a card, but would often surprise me at around age 2 by reading the words "fish" and "shop" and " mummy" whenever we saw them in big environment print. Like when we went to the fish and chip shop or mummy on the toilet door at the shopping centre. Oddly enough my son is doing the same thing now. In his play he can read many more words than when he is focussed. Its amazing how many lego words he can sound out or visually read as a whole word. Also yesterday he easily read a harder sight word heavy book than he could the day before...same words in many instances. I put it down to mood but I think now I need to reconsider that.....

[PokerDad]

Freestyle, my favorite. Don't forget the butterfly kicks off the wall....  .... j/k, but seriously that's great.

Reading isn't always so simple. There have been some documented failures in using flash cards and such, and I don't really think the experience is all that uncommon (maybe 20%?)...

If he's not getting it one way, then time to try another way in my opinion. Have you read DadDude's essay? His son started by learning the alphabet and constructing CVC words... and did YBCR while also starting on the Flesch cards (now made into ReadingBear.org)... perhaps focusing more on phonics and less on memory might yield some gain? Just a thought....

EDIT: PS.. I think you're right that there's a bias in reporting, that's well known... but also not sample like is the population you're sampling (EL) vs the typical or average - there will be a HUGE difference in the norms between the two, guaranteed, and with or without the reporting bias

[Korrale4kq]

I  Think it is hard to know what people actually mean by reading. To some it is just be able to recognise a word. To others it means decoding CVC words. To others it means being about to read sentences and to others it means reading and completely understanding, or even reading in their head. A lot of my friends consider their toddlers read when they look at book and babble or when they say all the words from memory.

To me... I consider reading, being able to read a sentence or more, that they have never seen before, with comprehension.

I have taught 5 kids to read. And although I  have not had the luxury of using little reader, I have used completely different methods with all kids. I used phonics word family flash cards with the first. I used Blumenfield's alphaphonics list, which I think is similar to Flesch's list. I taught whole words with the second and I taught a more synthetic phonics approach with the 3rd and 4th. And with the 5th, my son, I used whole words, and native reading approach with phonics on the side. He still struggles with phonics but he knows what to do. Decoding is just very hard work as opposed to learning whole words.

As for the ages of the kids, the first 2 were 3 years old. The first in early 3s. The second in later 3s. The first is now in highschool. And doing amazingly in school. She second is in middle school and struggles and needs tutoring for school.
The 3rd and 4th children started reading at 3. Then I stopped taking care of them. They went to a day care at 3 and backtracked and lost knowledge of how to read. at 5 they started reading in K and flew through several grade levels. It was like something dormant in them came to the fore and their reading just took off. Without formal testing I would hazard a guess to say they are 2nd or 3rd grade reading level.

My son is my earliest reader. It was only in the last couple of weeks that he went from reading single words to reading sentences and paragraphs with comprehension. He will be 3 in December.

I know it is all anecdotal but I honestly think reading at 3 is a good milestone accomplishment. I also biased because that is how old I was when I started reading too

[shadahfree]

For us, I think it was doing three languages that made things come slower. My dd is 4.5 and can read phonetically in English. She is sounding out words in Spanish and figuring out the alphabet sounds in German. I did Doman method paper flashcards and ppts until she was 2.5 and then switched to phonics. I wish now that I had done whole words longer. Maybe switched to phonics at age 4?
When we were doing flashcards she could usually pick out the right word when asked, but she never seemed to really "get" it, reading I mean. I though it a failure. I have noticed since then that she reads words that I taught her years ago without having to sound them out. Somewhere in her head she stored them, but didn't put it together to read without the phonics. I don't know if this makes sense to you or not.
We are back to doing cards. We do phonics related categories as well as whole word categories. By the way, I don't know if this matters to you, but she never seems to learn the words on the computer. When I right them out on paper flashcards, she learns them quickly.

[mybabyian]

Thanks everyone.  I find all your responses give me something to think about.  We are switching to a more phonics based approach, but not giving up the whole words completely.  He really liked readingbear for a while and that made me hopeful.  Then one day he was watching it and all of a sudden screamed out, “No!! Not this one.  NO!!!”  He seemed scared for some reason but I can’t imagine why.  I had even just asked him if he wanted me to turn it off and he said no.  So I am baffled. He hasn’t wanted it since.  But, we will try again later.  In the mean time I have some phonics power points that he likes.

@shadahfree, I have long suspected that he would learn better from paper cards.  Rationally, I can’t explain why that would be true except that it is more real to him and he would connect them more with me as I would be holding them.  I think kids want to learn from a live person more than a screen.  The problem has been that he wasn’t ever interested in or engaged by the flash cards.  Although that may be changing after I watched kmum’s video from another thread how she does flash cards. http://downsyndromeupupupandaway.blogspot.com/2011/05/fast-flashing-method.html

 I had seen her video before but this time I realized that even though I try to be enthusiastic I never celebrate like she does when she is done with the cards.  I decided to try again with something I knew Ian would like to see.  (He usually likes the cards once or twice and then looses interest.)  So I made him flash cards of the phases of the moon.  After we were done, I clapped and said “Yay, phases of the moon!!!!! Phases of the moon!!!!”  a bit like a lunatic.  He responded, “Home run!!!!”      So he has actually been liking the phases of the moon.  And I do not show him the cards more than once at a time to try to keep his interest up.  I think that may be a mistake I have also made in the past.   

We are also doing a lot of sound play with words which is something I picked up from when the ReadingWhisperer was posting a lot.  Like today, Ian said he wanted to play with the eggs (a game we have) and I grabbed his legs and said, “You want to play with LEGS?”  He thought that was funny.  I also asked him if he heard the ssssssss in basssssseball.  He said he did.  I know this is not going to teach him to read but maybe it can help.
Anyway, I think the great thing about EL is that I can still go about teaching him in a relaxed no-pressure way because I have time to try different things.  If he was 6 or 7 and not showing any progress then I would probably be a lot more concerned and he would pick up on that I am sure.   

Thanks again for all your posts.  And I’ll let you all know when he is doing flip turns.   

[kmum]

In the beginning I think my dd learned better with printed flash cards rather than on the computer too. Once she got started reading it didn't seem to matter anymore.

As hard as it is, I would try  to focus less on what exactly he knows & more on just continuing to input. Often kids store this info away & may not use it until later but are still learning. Also, by not focussing on what he knows you won't  be unconsciously putting pressure on him to learn. Just keep joyfully giving him input & I'm sure you will be amazed with the end result.

[Tamsyn]

Your story sounds a lot like mine with my first- except my oldest wasn't swimming like yours.  Wow!

I remember being so frustrated that he wasn't getting it.  I would see all of the YouTube videos of small children reading and wonder why mine wasn't.  Part of it was because I tried to teach him phonetically instead of with flashcards, and it wasn't until I bought Your Baby Can Read that we got our foot in the door.  Sidney Ledson has a more phonetic approach, and has had a lot of success teaching kids 2+ to read in Canada.  If you want to try a phonetic method, he's definitely worth checking out.  He's worth checking out anyway!

It's almost funny when I look back at the videos I made of my oldest when he was a toddler.  He knew a lot of bits, his diction was very clear, and he had an advanced vocabulary, but he wasn't reading.  When he did finally learn to read, he picked it up very quickly, and now, at 5, he is on about a 4th grade reading level.  The early learning I did with him really did make a difference.

My 23-month-old now, on the other hand, is still speaking with 1-2-word sentences.  He does have a large vocabulary, but he hasn't figured out the grammar yet.  On the other hand, he can read quite well (he will read but not speak full sentences), he can count to 10, and he can sing his ABCs in tune, minus a few letters.

My 3-year-old is/was somewhere in between.

Each child will get what they need from an Early Education, I think.  I like your analogy about how the parents who have the most success are the ones who are talking about it.  I lurked a lot back then too.  You're not alone!  And you're doing wonderfully.  Don't worry, a day will come when something will just click, and by and by, you will be amazed at how well your son is reading too.

[A_BC]

@ Mybabyian

The swimming  progress of your toddler is impressive. Can you please share what you did with him?
I think reading will catch up soon so don't worry. There is recurrent idea in Doman's books: physical training enhances cognitive development especially reading. So if I am you, why would I bother if my DS is "PHYSICALLY SUPERB". Hooray!

[mybabyian]

Thanks so much everyone. You are all such great moms.  I really like how everyone here has a no-pressure philosophy.  I guess I just wanted to know that I wasn't the only one in this situation.  It sounds like all kids have their own learning journey.   

I will check out Sidney Ledson.   Thank you Tamsyn.

@A_BC  I loosely followed Glenn Doman's swimming book when Ian was a baby.  I put him under water not long after his belly button healed.  We did "swimming" in the bath tub until he was about 8 months.  Then we started Mommy and Me swimming lessons.  We usually went 3 times a week but there were a few months we only went twice a week.  I think he progressed a bit faster than the other kids because we went often.  Also, during the lessons I would try to leave him under water for as long as I thought he could hold his breath and be comfortable to try to give him a chance to figure out how to move in the water.  I think other moms would scoop their kids up right away. 

It was a slow gentle process.  He was usually really into it.  When he learned how to do kickers he would lie on the floor in random places to show them off.  One time in particular we were on a walk and met a little girl his age so he thought he would lie on the sidewalk and show her his great kickers.    

I think what really helped him was a LittleReader file I made for him with videos of all the strokes.  I uploaded it to the library here but the file was too big so I had to take the videos out and scale it back quite a bit.     I think having a name with a short clip of what the strokes look like was really very helpful for him.  We would pretend to swim a lot while watching it.  And then he would pretend through out the day.  I think that helped him get the motor feeling of the strokes down. 

We stopped lessons during the summer because it is warm enough to use our own pool.  I would basically just let him swim and have fun and sometimes ask him to do kickers or try his strokes.  My husband and I were both competitive swimmers and I also coached for several years.  So, of course everyone says that is why he is a good swimmer.  I really think it has more to do with consistent, early exposure.  The fact that we were swimmers has little to do with it except that it was important for us to teach him to swim.

[A_BC]

Thanks a lot Mybabyian for sharing your experience. My son has just started swimming classes at 23 mos. I hope it's not too late to be able to make a good progress. But we'll try!

[PokerDad]

It's never too late....

well, I guess if you wait until they're 50. 2.5yrs is PLENTY young to make a huge difference - it's just the initial fear that might be harder than if you began at 6 months or less. After a few times, it'll be easy I think

[TeachingMyToddlers]

My first thought when reading this was "WOW, freestyle at 22 months old? Holy Smokes!" AMAZING! Your kid ROCKS!!!  Color me impressed...

[mybabyian]

Thank you TeachingMyToddlers, that is what I always think when I come on here and read what everyone is doing with their kids. 

23 m is definitely not too late.  Usually getting over the fear of the water, if he even has any, only takes a few lessons.  After that he will progress much faster than a baby because he already has more physical development than babies do.  As a coach I have seen lots of kids who didn't start swimming until way later and turned out to be excellent swimmers.

Thank you Tamsyn for the book recommendation.  I started reading it and it seems very good.  I might wait a few months to really get started with it.  But, I think it seems like once we do start it seems like a very good program.  When your first son finally did learn to read was it with that book?  I would love to know more about your experience with it. 

Thanks so much everyone. You are all such great moms.

Btw, I should have said moms and dads.   

[A_BC]

Thanks everybody for your kind words. My son hates the public swimming pool (too big? too many new faces?...) although he loves splashing in our backyard one. Hopefully he will get used to it

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